*
* The weather has suddenly turned cold, too early in the year, the day dark and unpleasing. I look at today's news wondering what paying attention to the details will bring me. I read the names, of the ones pushing oppression and the end, but for just a few of the star players I forget them. I much rather not get caught up in the game and understand the rules, and lack of rules, for it. Or who is who. I know America is a war country, I know its leaders corrupt and its society ill. I have a general idea of how their type of democracy was suppose to work and why it did not, and its obvious to the world that now it has been taken over and heading towards goals the masses had no idea were ahead. But I don't need to know their names or their lives or which one did something more scandalous than the next. People seem to spend more time finding out what is wrong than they do protesting what is wrong. When you read American blogs frequently they are like in a secret language with references to all kinds of people and obscure situations and odd comparisons. No wonder it is hard to understand, people can get lost in the confusion until their senses dull. I am sure all this is of importance somewhere but one need not know this and all the other things like it, to know what is right and what is wrong. Its very apparent that America is evil and in the wrong from just looking at the major signs. Knowing the details of evil is the job of some to fight it on the level they find it on, but knowing the truth, all one has to do is look at the overall view. Government hijacked, society sick, its people deluded and brainwashed, and, wanting to take over the world any way they can and use it for their own. Just this very obvious view of America should be enough for every person with hopes of a better future to be aware that it is something to fight against and be got rid of. Beware America, that is the message to spread, resist the Americanization of the world. Dark thoughts, dark days, how I wish the sun would just break loose of these clouds and warm me. I don't want to know to much, let them keep their details and I will watch the results, they are what really tells. Enough America for today, life should be good.
32 comments:
One way America influences the world, is the music industry. Youth watch music videos, and listen to rap and heavy metal, at the expense of jazz, folkloric etc.
I linked to your blog.
life should be good.
Indeed.
Ren, I think there is a revival of this interest for jazz and folkloric, also classics. And also generations: because those who loved rock and pop, stick to what they loved once, and their taste seems as old fashioned (in the eyes of their children, i.e. the next generation) as that of their parents seemd to them once. Also, you seem to forget that nowadays more is available, and that includes also quality: jazz and folkloric included.
The danger is, people feel good about themselves imitating america. I am confident, Yab, that we are also to blame, we human beings, though the degree of that blame is less than the one we ought to credit white america with. There is no reason for people to look upon the United States, or any nation for that matter, as heroic, or sometimes even sacred. Yes, those nations will want us to, but we should also have the wisdom to decide whether we ought to.
As you note, Zatikia, people are so involved with the minutae that they fail to see the wood for the trees.
renegade eye,
One of the wonderful things about Mexico, we retain our own music and that is what is still most popular. The corridos, songs with a story. But of course, there are those who think it more modern to listen to rap, even if in their own language, but they gain no respect for it.
And as soon as I am into that part of my blog, I will add your blog too, thank you.
Zatikia,
Some wonderfully refreshing thoughts! The U.S. is definitely dysfunctional! However, I can't go so far as to use the word "evil." What a tricky word! In particular, it seems precarious to try to personify "America" by qualifying it as "sick" or "evil." I cringe at the thought of the potential faces one puts on the idea of "America" when personifying it--especially when one holds it to be "evil."
For one thing, I am an American. I am not proud of my government. I disdain patriotism. Likewise, I loath its symbols and myths that misdirect and misinform. I do not, and will likely never, say the Pledge of Allegiance. I am a teacher, and I would never teach my students with the objective of making them patriots. I teach them to think critically of their reality. I teach them to assess their own crimes, misdeeds, etc. and to take responsibility for them. I teach them to set for themselves higher standards then they set for others. I teach them to see the interconnection of our entire globe.
However, that said, I am quite proud of many aspects of American culture and history. For example, I am proud of my fellow workers that have suffered –yet struggled against—the wrath of the employing class throughout American history. I am proud of the struggles of oppressed races, genders and sexual orientations. Therefore, if I were asked to personify "America" and put a face on it, I suppose I'd opt for the working class, American Indians, etc. Quite clearly, this face should not be seen as "evil" or "sick."
One of the things I respect about Fidel Castro--despite some obvious flaws--is that he has always been clear to distinguish between "America" and the "U.S. Government." Hugo Chavez seems to be embracing a similar pattern. This is important when discussing this North American empire. As a member of the working class, I see quite clearly that I have nothing in common with the employing class. Since the U.S. Government is beholden to the elite employing class, it represents as much of an obstacle to achieving true freedom and dignity to the American working class as it does to the working class around the world. Therefore, my common ground is with the global working class, the poor, the oppressed, etc.
On another level, "America" as an identifier is additionally tricky because it includes North America, Central America and South America. Perhaps we should reclaim the understanding that we are all Americans. Por eso, me gusta como actualmente el mundo hispano-parlante se está distinguiendo a los habitantes del imperio como "estadounidenses" en vez de "americanos." Todos somos americanos: peruanos, guatemaltecos, mexicanos, canadienses, etc. Al mismo tiempo, cuando uno quiere destacar un aspecto negativo, o un comportamiento feo ("malo" o "enfermo") cometido por unos estadounidenses, favor de agruparles como "yanquis." No soy ni "yanqui" ni “gringo” ni “gabacho,” pero sí soy americano como usted. Al mismo tiempo, soy estadounidense también…Sí hablo español.
I do not believe “America” is something “to be got rid of.” The U.S. government, perhaps! But, better yet, let’s look at the system that precedes the thinking that you—for lack of a better word—called “sick.” If there exists a system—a superstructure—that pervades every aspect of our lives (both Mexican and American alike) especially the formulation of our thinking, what hope is there that we will ever “get rid of” any of the dysfunctional effects by calling them “evil.” It isn’t the effects that are “evil” or even dysfunctional, but the cause. That cause is a system that divides, oppresses, and has an insatiable appetite for profit. That system is capitalism. It isn’t the “Americanization” of the world one should fear, but the “Coca-Cola-ization” or “McDonaldsization” of the world! Resist branding by corporations! Resist corporate globalization! Resist capitalism! Resist orthodoxies como el fin de la historia!
"but the “Coca-Cola-ization” or “McDonaldsization” of the world! Resist branding" - Bob, two things to this: how to resist corruption (on high level, but also local) and support the local industries? Because these two have a lot to do with what you've just said. Also, how can one create time and space for these people? All these take part in poorer places, and I have the feeling that the middle class is growing poor(if there is one): hence it is more feeble and an easier target.
Redwine,
*Educate
*Organize
*Emancipate
Resist corporate corruption and support local industries by creating local communities committed to social and economic justice. Communities across the U.S. are passing binding Sweatfree resolutions. In my own community (Missoula, MT), an amazing organization, CAJA (Community Action for Justice in the Americas: www.caja.org), is finding wide support for a Sweatfree Community Campaign. If you like, you can read about Sweatfree communities at: www.sweatfree.org
Another simple thing one can do is to support local farmers' markets. You know: Buy Fresh/Buy Local. These kinds of actions are neither frivolous nor superficial. Through buying our food from local farmers (Missoula's farmers' market has grown into a hugely popular cultural event!) one is also conserving massive amounts wasted energy in the transportation/storage costs implied in our food system. Simply planting one's own garden in any green space in our community can become a revolutionary act. Take back our public space with community gardens—even in urban settings—and we are resisting the corporatization of our world. Local farmers (who are largely Hmong, Hudderite, Hispanic, and Russian minorities) are benefiting from this local action.
Set up local "free-schools." Very little money is needed, just a belief in unfettered community education. Anarchist Spain once ran free-schools with the idea of encouraging self-reliance, critical consciousness, as well as community and personal development. Young idealistic students set up the Missoula Free School with these very same beliefs.
Foster direct democracy by promoting community organizing. Encourage neighborhood groups to demand a role in local decision making. Take back local governments that were hijacked by conservative elites in our communities. For example, look at local school boards that are being manhandled by conservative bankers, lawyers, and business owners. Replace them with citizens from the growing poor class. When all else fails, encourage local level communities to take direct action to affect change.
Finally, one of the best ways to tie education, organization and emancipation together is through radical union participation. We must get people to organize themselves through their daily work. Unions like the Industrial Workers of the World still exist. Organizing all workers into One Big Union is still a practice: making an injury to one an injury to all. A lucid example of the genuinely positive effects of a general strike, took place in a most recent event in Chile. The high school students in that country were able to rally together the largest mass mobilization since Pinochet to their cause. Joining them in the general strike were their teachers, administrators, educational experts, labor unions, churches and other social stakeholders. As a result, they won a voice in the decision-making process for the reform of that country's educational policy in a relatively short time period (three months).
Calling it "evil" is not enough! Educating our fellow community members of the benefits to supporting local business is tantamount to resisting corporate capitalism. The most recent E. Coli scare is a great point of departure for this kind of education. Why not encourage local communities to take direct control of their lives, especially our most basic needs: i.e. food, housing, and labor. Can't we imagine an organized group of local farmers benefiting from the protection of an educated local community that demanded their local products in lieu of the heavily subsidized Agribusiness products that are genetically modifying, chemically processed and unsafe?
Paulo Freire, Pedagogy of the Oppressed, suggested posing problems for communities to solve and making education an informal process. This means that we engage in dialogical learning rather than the transmission of “facts.” Instead of having “teachers/leaders” educate the masses from on high, the oppressed can only become aware of their oppressor through action that is informed and linked to certain values. Creating the “time and space” for a community to dialogue about its problems is the key. As mentioned above, these spaces—where praxis is linked to education—are local: farmers’ markets, neighborhood circles, free schools, unions, etc.
Che Bob, the difference in our views is that you are looking at America from within and I am looking at it from with out. There are many Americans not proud of their government anymore and they disapprove of much that goes on and make a point to be aware of it. But this does not change the deaths of those your country has killed. A nation that kills for the reasons America does must be looked at for that act, not the good people back home who did not like it. It doesn't really matter in the long run if you are clean living and promote goodwill, your country doesn't. It is a killer. To me, killing is evil. I don't believe in it. Especially as an answer to getting what one wants. You sound like a good teacher, it is nice to hear from one, as there is always room for hope, especially when spread among the youth. Although I do have little hope for your country, it seems its time is nearly up. And the decay I see in the family unit and learning turned into entertainment, and of course the government and their techniques. So many signs everywhere, rotting away like an illness. And now your government has gotten away from you and ruined your reputation world wide and 9/11 day has made you look weak. It really does feel your days are numbered. But back to the word evil, yes, that is what the word should mean, killing, destroying, plotting, undermining, taking over, done for greed and power. If not, then what does the word evil mean?
I just looked up the word evil, to see if a dictionary agreed with me, morally reprehensible, is the first meaning. Now that describes what America does to the world perfectly. We need to see America for what it really is so we can conquer it.
"Instead of having “teachers/leaders” educate the masses from on high,' - Bob, volunteers can help a lot when needed, yet one needs trained teachers and doctors, etc. The competition is with a highly professional world. However, education should start at home, and that again, is a problem, with parents who work till late etc. (Large families - sharing the same space - died out long ago.) Also, how do you expect people from large cities, from a very urban environment , to buy local for example? Also, the same old problem, local and fresh can be more expensive: some will not be able to allow it.
My related comments here both musical and political would be too long. I've posted them instead on the Further Left Forum in one titled "Dreaming Of Reality".
locallization is not only the way to withhold the lifeblood of corporations, it is a way to reorganize the top heavy central government to return decision making to smaller, more representative bodies loosely coordinated by a bare bones central committee. Okay, so let's do it.
Zatikia, that was a nice response to yet another american trying his best to fool us into thinking that his nation is not really that evil. "Some maybe, but by and large we are good people you know". No, we do not; we refuse to consider people to be good when they elect governments that commit atrocities in the rest of the world, both overt and covert. Good people, are above all, responsible people; when it is my responsibility to ensure that my government is just, I am not good if I shirk off that responsibility. The government is there representing me; or better, the government IS me. I don't become good by closing my eyes to the evil I do.
So get lost american, you aren't fooling anyone. Not the ones with a dark skin anyway. They have suffered at your hands and know better.
Pocho, a very good read it is, thank you for posting the link here to it. It makes for an excellent story with a worthy point.
Gregrandgar, backing up is hard to do, especially when there is such a rush forward. But its a good idea.
Atanu, Some people try hard to be good in certain ways, but one really can´t attain that when what their government does wipes that score out. If you live in America you are part of that evil, no way around it. America needs to see its own evil and face it in order to realize what is really happening.
Atanu,
A more sensible and respectable Indian than yourself recently said: "The only institution more powerful than the U.S. government is American civil society. Hundreds of thousands of you have survived the relentless propaganda you have been subjected to, and are actively fighting your own government... I hate to disagree with your president: yours is by no means a great nation. But you could be a great people" (Arundhati Roy).
It's a pathetic commentary that I came to this site to engage in what I had hoped to be open-minded dialogue only to find the exact same ugliness many of you pretend to disdain. For example, does this ring a bell Atanu? "So get lost american, you aren't fooling anyone. Not the ones with a dark skin anyway. They have suffered at your hands and know better." Well done indeed Atanu...you sad, sad person!
(Zatikia, I’m surprised you did not censure this particular comment by Atanu when I’ve seen you censure him/her in the past.)
All that has been accomplished through this post and the resulting infantile behavior is the alienation a potential ally in a struggle against a common adversary. Did you bother to check the color of my skin before you attacked me? Should we get out our genders, races, sexual orientations, activist resumes and compare scars? I suggest you look up the definition of "evil" Zatikia found and make sure you're not acting in "morally reprehensible ways" towards a person you have never met.
Noting your aversion to white skin, I will leave you with one last thought/insult from a wiser man than you (and yes, he's white!): "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. When you gaze long into the abyss, the abyss also gazes into you." -- Friedrich Nietzsche
Che Bob,
I prefer my blog focus on other than scolding each other for different attitudes. Atanu has something to say and we are fortunate we get to hear it, the other side. This is what happens when egos like America push around those smaller than them, they nip back. You speak from the so called superiority of an American who has no enemies. Many people hate you for what you are, American, your country is hated. This is not an intelluctual exercise, not a contest to produce the best answers. This is about evil and hating it. You have your level up there in your education, I don´t, I have it in my feelings. Please do not insult those who come to my blog to respond, instead, find something to learn about what you see here, what they have said. I´m not here to debate, but to try to tell you something you need to know, your country is an evil, you live in an evil country, like it or not, you are part of that evil. And you will be hated for it. Face it.
Also Che Bob, I appreciate you taking your time and your thoughts to add what you have and you have honest things to say. America is the enemy and what you say is an insight.
And to Atanu, I have let slip a rude remark of yours and it looks bad on my blog and has caused comment. Don´t push it, or I will not let you post here. We can say what we need to without the insults. You fight those battels elsewhere.
Hate away if you think it's going to help. I'm pretty sure it won't change a thing. It will definitely consume energy that could be put to better use. Just think, if all it took was to hate something bad enough to make it go away, then the U.S. would be long gone. Unfortunately, this is not how things work. What ever happened to "peace begins with me"?
I have traveled throughout the world and experienced anti-American sentiment everywhere. I not only understand it and appreciate its cause, I share a lot of the same feelings held by those who hate America. I was originally attracted to this site because of a common interest: ending U.S. cultural, economic, and political hegemony! I, for one, do not even believe in nations. I would like to see the whole lot of them go away. I cannot agree with you though that the people that make up these nations aren't worth saving. If that were the case, that would mean getting rid of all the people of all the nations in the world. The "evil" you speak of cannot be solely attributed to the U.S. as every nation has all manner of sins, atrocities, "evil", dysfunction. Though I would agree with you that the U.S. government stands virtually alone as a beacon of destruction, I cannot sanction the notion that China, Russia, India, Pakistan, Israel, France, Mexico, Colombia, Australia, the Netherlands, Great Britain, Spain, Japan, Zimbabwe and Canada are free from guilt.
Let's take Mexico for example. The Mexican government has been corrupt/"evil"/oppressive throughout its history. Why else would that country allow its masses to starve and suffer while a small handful of elite bask in their billions of dollars? Why is there a current uprising in Oaxaca that the government all Mexicans helped elect is violently repressing? What about Chiapas? What about Cuidad Juarez?
I have meditated on the idea that I must face being hated. Okay, I've listened to you and I now realize that I am hated for being American...fine. I see that I am lumped in with the rest of the Americans. I'm one of them. I'm a part of the "evil" that is so hated. Okay, now what? Should I hate myself? Should I kill myself since there is nothing I can do to fix things according to several of the contributors to this blog? What are you suggesting I do now? Should I move my family to Mexico and contribute to its "evil"? WHAT, other than just simply saying what we hate, ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO?
So before I decide what to do, let me sincerely ask you if you meant what you said: "This is not an intelluctual exercise, not a contest to produce the best answers. This is about evil and hating it." Did you really mean this? Did you mean to say that coming to Zatikia's website is about "evil and hating it"? I just want to be clear. Thank you.
Che Bob, my decision to make a blog is to let it be known that America is evil and should be hated for it. Hate, like love, is an emotion and we can kill or construct behind it. There is so much to be discovered and learned, but there is more than
facts and data and ideas, there is feeling. I think Americans have lost their sense of horror, it has been dulled from a history
of abusing others to get what they want. For you to say your country is not evil shows me that something is very wrong with you and those like you. It is proper to hate evil, that is how we stay away from it and fight it. It should just jar are reality and make our senses go on alert. Hate is not something you can decide not to feel because it is not appropriate anymore. Hate is a force and it should not be dissipated until one can accept a country that kills and says that it is not evil. How can you not hate the evil your country does, and evil is the only way to describe the terrible things they do. I truly feel that if Americans would look at themselves for what they really are, they would be closer to making that change that could save them and the rest of the world. Hate your own evil.
All nations and all governments have their sins and their evils, big and small, but that does not diminish the fact that America is quickly leading the way to worse and worse. And since you bring up Mexico, yes, its politicians take way more than their fair cut of the share and some people are oppressed. But how far different that is than corrupting the world for your own purposes and destroying what was good in your nation in order to grab more power. Mexico is not in others countries undermining and plotting, killing and destroying, tipping whole balances and lifestyles, promoting a modern way of life that in the long run is the worst form of oppression of all.
I really don´t know what you Americans can do about your country but you claim it is of the people. Perhaps if you would start helping put out the idea that America is evil and to beware of it instead of trying to act like what it does is not evil would help. The image of a safe and helpful America is false and dangerous.The quicker the world views America for what it is, the better chance we have of defending ourselves. I can tell in many ways we want to see the same thing and it is important all that work in this direction understand each other, even if we cannot totally agree. Thank you for responding again and letting me know how you feel about this.
Zatikia,
Your hate is making you blind. You don't even seem to have read a word I said. I have very loudly and clearly denounced the atrocious acts my country has committed and continues to commit. Have you even read any of my blog? I feel very strongly that you have only heard me say: "America" is not evil without understanding what I meant by that comment. Notice the quotation marks around the word "America." I was trying to discern what was meant by "America," not to say that the U.S. government is not "evil."
To be very clear to you Zatikia:
1. I feel the U.S. government commits vicious crimes including killing, torture, wars, etc.
2. I feel many U.S. government officials dating back many years should be brought up on war crimes, crimes against humanity, etc.
3. I feel a great deal of corporate oligarchs are engineering the destruction of the global environment, diverse culture and languages, whole societies, etc. (However, these corporate monsters are not restricted to U.S. nationalities).
4. I expend a great deal of my energy pointing out to my fellow countrymen the atrocities committed in the name of this country.
This is just a sampling of the kinds of things you apparently have been unable to understand in my comments. Please read carefully through my comments and my blog. I feel you will find a voice that is not promoting "America", least of all the U.S. government!
If you've only come to help me, then return to your homes. If you consider my fight as part of your own survival, then perhaps we can work together. - Australian Aboriginal Saying
As I've said countless times, our fight is a mutually shared one: the class war! Native Americans are quick to point out that there is no such thing as "race", just "racism." Our survival depends on "have-nots" confronting the "haves." Frantz Fanon would call them the "oppressors." Zatikia might call them "evil" and she might "feel" they reside in the United States. My argument is that they--the "evil-doers"--are the capitalist class and they are everywhere and must be confronted if any of us are to survive.
I haven't "come to help" you Pocho, I've come to find allies in a fight against what Zatikia feels/senses/emotes is the "evil" in this world. However, determining exactly who is "evil" is highly problematic when using only intuition. Have any of you seen Monty Python's "Holy Grail"? Remember the scene with the "witch"? The magistrate asks: "How do we know she's a witch?" To which the crowd responds: "'Cause she looks like one!" Remember also that she had been dressed up to look the part by the lynch mob.
What exactly is your fight? Is it against "evil"? How are you fighting it? What is working? Not working?
Zatikia, of course it was rude and highly discourteous on my part to ask an american get lost, but don't call it slip, quite the contrary. It was totally deliberate and meant. I am amazed that it almost made you think whether you should allow me to comment in here! I think you ought to encourage it. Remember, nothing done to a white man is ever wrong, so let us forget our niceties when it comes to them. A white is never innocent, by the very colour of his skin. However, if Mr. Che Bob is a dark skinned american, I do withdraw my comment. But then again, he is guilty nevertheless to hang around with the white race and enjoy the fruits of their plunder the world around.
In reading this discussion I hear two voices in basic agreement, but unable to overcome certain nuanced but important obstacles of linguistics and revolutionary theory. The most obvious blockade to understanding seems to be this word "evil" and everything it suggests.As someone who feels organized religion generally stands in the path of emancipation (liberation theology perhaps an exception),I argue that it is better to try to find a clearer term with less religious baggage to describe reactionaries, oppressors,tyrants, etc.. Certainly "morally reprehensible" could be a useful definition if we can agree on some universally recognized moral code, such as thou shall not kill.This might sound like more do-nothing- leftist-intellectual-exercising but I believe history shows the disasters that can occur when these problems are not worked out PRIOR to acting.
Zatikia is correct, "Americans" should be in the streets, filling the jails, refusing to work, pay taxes or in any other way support this empire.I am ashamed that more citizens, and especially more fellow workers are not enraged but this is the work that Che Bob and I try to do on a daily basis, at the same time as we try to earn livings and stay sane.It is a contradiction we are both very aware of here in the belly of the beast, just as we are very aware of the color of our skin and all the priveledge associated with that.Atanu is not telling us some profound truth, just displaying his own susceptibility to divisive propaganda.This is the opposite of movement building and plays right into the hands of capitalists.
che bob,
I understand you and your blog. The better side of America. I have no doubt that there are aware people in America, I have spoken with others. I did not think the question was if I believed in what you said about yourself and your country, but rather the question is, is your country evil and is it correct to accuse it of being sick. I still say yes and hope that you can view it for what it is too. America, the dream no more.
Evil is everywhere, Americans have found out how to make a business of it. Americanization is a world problem, it is popping up everywhere you look. The haves in this case are the Americans making wars and the have nots are the ones dying and suffering from it. You are killing people while you decide what to vote on next. One may refer to names like Frantz Fanon to state what their opion is on oppressors or you can just call it evil. I think we should simplyfy the message. One need not make a study of it to know the truths. The issues are clouded in words and names to the point where there is no sting to them. We know evil is wrong, there is no doubt about that, call it what it is. America is evil.
Remember che bob, I do not live in your reality, I don´t know who Monty Python is. I am giving you a glimpse into my own reality and instead of learning from it and adding to what you already know you attempt to tell me why I should not think as I do and why you are right. There is no contest here. Im telling you my view, take it or leave it, its not up for debate or to be displayed dissected by your clever wording. You are not here so I can learn from you, you have come to my blog to learn about me . So please back off and limit your demands on why I said what I have, just accept it as my opinion.
And as to your questions, I have no list of easy numbers in a step by step process to successs in the fight against evil with all its accompanying lables. I live right, I do right, I stay in balance, thats it.
Atanu,
I do not encourage violence, even in attitudes towards each other here. It may just be a blog but peace starts at the bottom. I would like to explore everyones opinions and not just listen to ideas that compliment mine. Anger short circuits what we can find out and then that is all we are left with. It is not just a matter of what we are doing to the other person, we are letting it turn us unpeaceful ourselves. We cannot get our small piece of revenge right here, there is no evening of score like that. I want to learn who it is that is the enemy and who shouldn´t be but is.
troutsky,
The trouble with the term morally reprehensible, or others like it, is that it is merely a description of another word, evil. The word evil you don´t have to think about, you know down inside you what it is. It would be like calling love totally enarmored, or some other two words. It reduces it. Love and hate, good and evil. Evil is what America does. It kills for profit, its made killing a business technique and now it rapes its own country in the name of safety. What needs to be taught to the world in simple terms is that America is evil, and evil is to be avoided. For the most part, the world does not read what is the latest to call something, but everyone knows the word evil and its translations. Let the word evil carry its baggage, all of it so it has more meaning for all. Basicaly and at its core, America is no good, and it is proving this by the way it is so rapidly falling apart. We need to tell the world America is evil, beware.
I think it would be a contradiction to be an American and care. I am sure your job is near ovewhelming in its need to enlighten America. And knowledge comes from everywhere and when you have a chance you should search out what comes up.
just displaying his own susceptibility to divisive propaganda
Troutsky, people have said various things about me, but what you said there was novel. I stand for the extermination of the white race, and I have not seen even one instance of it in your honourable media. Can't really call that a propaganda therefore, can you?
Atanu is not telling us some profound truth
Now that was interesting. Do you mean to tell me that you are aware of the shameless acts of loot and plunder that your nation has been responsible for? Now in case you happen to, something I seriously suspect, then you are correct; I am indeed not telling you any profound truth. Only reminding you of your nation's past and present, and the way I see it, it's future. And the reasons why people all over ought to stop mourning on the anniversaries of 9/11 and instead take their champagne out.
This exchange is a textbook example of why governments like the US has developed over my life time. The present government is precisely what it has been intended to be all along by using a perverted two party system to fool the people they had a choice in where they were taking the country anyway. I have never seen a campaign run on issues important to the people. There are a large majority of US citizens who are wise to the immensity of the evil being wreaked on the world by a government gone rogue more obviously every day.
But the solution to their single minded rape of the human will, solidarity in getting rid of the system that allowed such evil to occur, is procrastinated by everyone wanting their gored ox to be healed first. Atanu wants the extermination of everything whiter than him, Zatikia and Pocho hate everything about "America" and want it to disappear, Che Bob and Troutsky and I hate what our government is doing with their coup from within and are vigorously working to wake up the ignorantly complicit, because we live here and care about the potential for good being perverted by heretofore unimaginable malice and averice of our own government. Until the goal and method of achieving it is made as single minded in our opposition to opression as that of the oppresor, we are just opressing each other with the same self serving attitudes we find evil in the enemy.
"There is no path. Paths are made by walking. The only path seen looking back is as a wave in the sea, one never to be treaded again." - Antonio Machado. And, a line of a freedom song: "Gonna keep on a walking, Keep on a talkin, 'Till I get to freedom land." None of us may get there no matter which way we go, but we can make it easier for those that will yet forge on as they discover their own routes.
Gregrandgar,
You must remember, the Americanization of the world is not just about politics and government. It is about a whole way of life, an entire mindset. It is America as a whole that must be rejected. The planet has no room for a nation that uses and abuses so much. To live like Americans do one must use up more than their fair share.
You are right to say you hate your government, that is the appropriate emotion. If we do not hate these things we become to comfortable living with them. Hate is a force and when not abused can be used constructively. One should also hate the fact that the American public has allowed their lives to be so molded on what their government wants of them, they allowed it.
America disappear, if only. Snatched by its privilaged white collar to never be heard about again.
Pocho,
Good wisdom. I hope there will always be new paths to discover.
Nothing good ever came of hate and a lot of bad has come from those who claim to know absolute truth, such as who is good and who is evil.Read up on the Salem witch trials.Fight oppression and injustice , it is much easier to identify and you don't need to exterminate or exorcise to rid the planet of it.
troutsky,
Those are very fine words and I admire them. Perhaps at one time they may even have been enough for me to believe in. But how many people really fight oppression and injustice, obviously not enough to make a change that is worthwhile. We must have motivation to fight, and knowing that oppression and injustice exist are not enough. There are no absolute truths, but we cannot say nothing good has come from hating. In the name of love has done disasters too. Hate and love are forces, we need to know how to direct them. It is not people we need to fight but how they are treated. Oppression and injustice are evil. We need strong feelings to fight these, especially when they do not affect us daily. I say we need to hate them to fight them. Like we need to love to be able to care. Full spectrum, there is no sense in cutting it short to just intellectual. Go by our instincts. The evil has been identified well enough, we need to move on.
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